Exclusive Interview: Pop Culturalist Chats with GAYLE

Singer-songwriter GAYLE is the breakout artist of 2021. The emerging songstress has taken the music industry by storm with her uncanny ability to pen pop anthems that are empowering for both the artist and the listener.

Her debut single for Atlantic, “abcdefu” has quickly become the song of the year.

Pop Culturalist was lucky enough to speak with GAYLE about discovering her passion for music, “abcdefu,” and more.

PC: How did you discover your passion for music?
GAYLE: I started singing at seven, so everything before seven is a blur now. [laughs] I’m not sitting here being like, “When I was four…” But when I was in school I learned about scatting. It was in music class. They were teaching us about Ella Fitzgerald and they showed a video of her scatting. I came home and I couldn’t stop scatting. It was so intriguing and interesting to me that people could make up things on the spot. Then I started performing for my family.

At Thanksgiving, we’d have this big, long table. I’d be like, “Everybody’s seated for my performance. This is great.” I started performing. Then, my poor mother…we’d go out to dinner and I’d go up to random strangers and I’d be like, “You want to hear me sing?” They’re like, “Sure.” So, I’d be singing in restaurants—literally anywhere. I was the kid that didn’t know they needed to be afraid of strangers or people in general. My mom was like, “Well, if she’s going to be singing all the time I might as well put her in vocal lessons.” It grew from there.

PC: Who or what has had the biggest influence on your career?
GAYLE: Aretha Franklin has always been a huge inspiration for me. When I came home and started scatting, that’s all I would do. My mom was like, “I need to show her something else because this is literally all she’s doing.” [laughs] She showed me Aretha Franklin. I remember it was this thirty-minute compilation of Aretha.

Career day was the week before. I remember I went as a dog rescuer. You had to dress up as the career you wanted to be. I just wanted to rescue dogs. I literally showed up to career day with a stuffed animal. I was like, “Here.” [laughs] I was so proud of myself.
I started to realize that I needed to figure out what I wanted to do with my life. I didn’t feel pressure. I was only seven, but I knew that that was a thing I was going to have to do eventually. I watched Aretha sing, and I just felt a feeling that I’d never felt before in my life.

I became more determined than I’d ever been. I was like, “I want to be Aretha Franklin when I grow up. This is what I want to do with my life.” I was so stubborn and I stuck to it. Her soul, her vocal ability, and her talent as a performer have always been such a big inspiration for me. That grew to also include Joss Stone and Nina Simone and all those powerful singers. Before I even knew what songwriting was, it was always these big powerful singers that really inspired me. Julia Michaels is also an inspiration. Just the fact that she’s had the opportunity to write for other artists while still having her own artist projects. Writers like Justin Tranter and Delacey have also been recent inspirations.

PC: Tell us about “abcdefu” and the inspiration behind the song.
GAYLE: I wrote this song with my best friend. The best thing about writing with your best friend is she remembers everything. Things that I don’t remember about my ex, she’d be like, “Remember that thing you did six months ago?” I’m like, “Oh my God. I forgot about that because I forgave him for it.” I forgive and I forget, but my best friend holds onto all of it. [laughs] I was coming out of this relationship. We had broken up. This person had been one of my best friends. I thought I could maintain that after the breakup. I was like, “Things don’t have to change. We just aren’t dating anymore. That’s fine. We can still talk on the phone weekly.” I was so dumb and innocent, but I felt guilty for breaking up with him. I didn’t want to act like it changed anything. I pretended that everything was fine.

Even in the relationship, he would do things that would piss me off, but I wouldn’t let it piss me off. I put it away in my brain and I forgot about it. I was like, “It’s fine. It’s fine. I’ll let go of it.” I was trying really, really hard to be a nice person and not be a b*tchy ex-girlfriend. Even on the phone, there were always these little digs, but I would let it go because I was trying to be the amicable ex-girlfriend. We had a mutual friend. I was talking to her and I was like, “We’re in such a good place with our friendship.” She was like, “He’s not really saying nice things about you. He won’t stop talking about you. He’s telling everyone that you’re not over him and you’re jealous.” At the time, he was dating a mutual friend of ours.

I was so proud of myself. I’d be like, “How is your girlfriend? I hope you’re both doing well.” I was trying so hard to be a supportive person. When I found out that he was talking sh*t about me, there was such a wide range of emotions that came rushing in. I was mad at first. I was like, “He’s talking all this sh*t about me.” I was trying so hard to be such a nice person to him. Regardless, no matter what I was going to do, he was always going to see the negative in the situation. He wanted me to be the jealous ex who wasn’t over him. No matter what I did. That was the narrative he wanted in his brain.

The other thing was that I was pissed that I had waited until I found out he was talking sh*t about me to let myself to be mad. I’m allowed to be mad. I can be mad at somebody’s actions. If they do something that pisses me off, I’m allowed to be pissed off at them. I was also writing super self-deprecating songs because I felt like I had ruined everything. I was like, “I ruined our friendship. I messed everything up. I’m the worst.” Then I was like, “No, you’re the worst.” It came out super aggressive because I had suppressed it for so long. I remember I walked into the room and wrote this song with Sara Davis and Dave Fincher. They’re both amazing. I’ve known Sara a bit longer. I was like, “Sara, now is the time.” [laughs] She was like, “Thank God.”

It really started out as a rant. I was like, “I f*cking hate his mom.” I was never able to say that, but she was such a b*tch to him. I hated his sister, his brother, and his dad. I hated his car and his job. He bought this car off Craigslist and in twenty-four hours it broke. After we broke up, he got with his coworker, the one that I was told not to worry about. It exploded into this big mess. That’s how “abcedfu” was born.

PC: You released a couple of versions of the song. How did that come to fruition?
GAYLE: “Abcdefu” was originally written on guitar. It was genuinely just three people in a room, messing around, and laughing about writing a song about telling my ex to f*ck off. That’s how the demo version started. It was literally what we made that day. “Abc” has this rock element. Not necessarily that it’s labeled in the rock genre, but there’s a grittiness to it that I wanted to be able to show. But there’s also a poppiness in the melodies that I wanted to lean into.

I wanted to have a version that leans into the grit and the messiness, but I thought, especially as a hook for the song, I should lean more into the poppiness. I thought that would be a better way to go. That’s where the OG version of the first version came from. It has a bit of a rock-leaning sensibility. I don’t necessarily want to even label it as rock, but it took inspiration from the genre, specifically in the electric guitars. But there’s also a poppiness at times with the drum sounds that are used. Pete Nappi did a really great job of blending the two. That came out with the original. That one actually said, “F*ck you. Abcde f*ck you.”

I was sitting there and I was like, “This doesn’t make sense. The song says ‘abcdefu.’ I want to say f*ck you, but I’ve said it so many times.” [laughs] But I was like, “No, this is a specific f*ck you that I want to include.” That’s where my brain went. That’s how I came up with this angrier version. I wanted messier drums. I wanted louder crowd vocals. I wanted more distortion on the electric guitar, especially as we had already released the poppier leaning version. It was easier to lean into an angrier version of it.

But I was also thinking about the acoustic version. For some reason, I imagined this prom or school talent show where I might perform a slowed down version. It’s a prettier version of “abc” because I find it really funny with the harmony and strings, but I’m telling someone to f*ck off the whole time. That’s how all the versions were made.

Pop Culturalist Speed Round

PC: A band or artist that fans would be surprised to learn is on your playlist?
GAYLE: Sebastian Paul. He’s really good. I like his stuff. At times, he leans more on the EDM side.

PC: First album you bought?
GAYLE: It was Kidz Bop. I was so excited. I auditioned to be in Kidz Bop every round I possibly could. I’d send in my video tape. I remember that I always used the same song. I think it was “Think” or the cup song.

PC: First concert you attended?
GAYLE: Aretha Franklin.

PC: An album that changed your life and why?
GAYLE: Aretha’s I Never Loved a Man the Way I Love You. It’s the lyrics—and the soul that she performed it with. I could listen to that song and that album all day long. It’s amazing.

PC: A venue on your bucket list to perform at?
GAYLE: Bridgestone Arena. That’s a big one. Fun fact: I was the background dancer for one night for Roger Waters. I was twelve and in Nashville. I moved to Nashville and somehow got roped into doing it. They had a hockey game and I didn’t realize that they had turned it into a concert setting. I was a background dancer for him, but I thought we were going to have to do it on ice. [laughs] I was like, “I don’t know how the f*ck you want me to do this, but here we are. I’m going to make it work.” I didn’t have to dance on ice.

But the thing is, it was so mean because it was just one song. I walked onto the Bridgestone stage and I’m pretty sure there were over 10,000 people. It was crazy. It’d be a full-circle moment to come back there and perform.

PC: A must-have on the road?
GAYLE: Headphones. I love being around people. But when I need to be alone, I just need to put my headphones on and be in a corner.

To keep up with GAYLE, follow her on Twitter, Instagram, Spotify, and, Apple Music. Pick up or stream “abcdefu” today.